Reincarnation Revisited

Life

In order to even try to understand reincarnation, I think we have to understand what life is. I know I have said it before, (The following is entirely my opinion, belief, and experience!) life is not just some unkown or unknowable energy force existing in our universe. Life is the universe. Life is the cosmos! Unfortunately most living beings take life for granted. They are alive, life is but a journey from birth to death. It is that, to be sure, but it is so much more. It doesn’t just start with a germinated spore, a fertilized seed or egg, it pre-exists the spore or seed or egg. It is the raison d’être of the cosmos.

I realize this is an insufficient statement for most deep thinkers, you want proof of life. But unlike the human idea of a god which can never be seen or otherwise known, we experience being alive every day of our lives. We just don’t think about it per se, we are satisfied to have it, and do it, without having to acknowledge it. Why should we, it has been with us every moment since our births. Big deal, eh? But it is a big deal, and that is why we must learn to acknowledge it. Not worship it, just acknowledge it. And feel it in your body, because you can feel it. You know you are alive.

Yes, I have failed to meet the burden of proof. We cannot measure life, we cannot pull it out of ourselves, we cannot literally point to it. But we can measure its absence when it leaves us. Its corollary is death, and we know when a body loses life. That body no longer functions. So if we know death, we must also know life. What do you think?

Death

If life is a big question mark, even though everyone and everything that has ever lived has experienced life, then what is death? At first glance, death is the taking away of life. In fact, if life appears from nowhere, death should return one to nowhere. That is logical. But life itself is not logical, is it? Can life really appear from nowhere? Who knows? But when you start to think about it, when you start to look at the realities of life, little clues begin to pop up that make us wonder…

Life itself comes in many forms, from viruses and bacteria, to plants, to animals. Each of those come in millions or billions of varieties, just on this Earth alone. And for now I am not going to discuss life as it may or may not exist on other worlds, we have no actual experience of life on other worlds. On earth, all life has the same building blocks, called cells. DNA, RNA, nucleii, cell walls, etc. I am not a biologist, I have limited knowledge of these things, and the molecules and atoms that make them up. But, basically, life as we understand it starts at the cellular level–in that we are all the same. Cells live, cells die. We are made of cells. We live, we die. We have at least that much in common. To say it another way, death ends our physical lives on Earth.

The Middle Ground: Reincarnation

Is physical life all there is? Many people believe life is only physical. Science can only look at the physical, what you can see is what you get. Religious folk, on the other hand, believe life is more non-physical than it is physyical. They, especially Christians and Muslims, believe in eternity, a perpetual life spent in Heaven or Paradise. But to what end? The idea of reincarnation actually predates the idea of heaven, and in its own way eternity lovers owe their beliefs to the concept of reincarnation. To be “born again” is to reincarnate, but through bad translations and lack of imagination, in my opinion, the concept was bastardized, disfigured, reworked until it came to mean one physical life, in which if you were “born again in Christ,” you got to advance to eternity. The rest of us, well, if they were not born again, or if they never heard of Christ, were condemned to an eternity in hell–a place of great suffering and pain. Not very charitable or hospitable of these neighbourly Christians or Muslims, I would have to say.  Nor of their compassionate God! For a forgiving father figure, he turns out to be nothing but a tyrannical dictator.

My own journey away from religion began when I first came to realize that no matter what people thought of themselves or how good they “believed they were being,” maybe one in a million, if that, would end up in heaven. Especially if, the gods knows how, God knows every thought a person has, people keep on sinning whether they have been born again in Christ or not, showing they are not worthy of heaven, ever. Hell would be everyone’s eternal destination. So either there is no heaven or hell, or God the father is one true prick, without a gram of compassion in his entire being…

Most times when there are two extremes of thought, the actual truth lies somewhere in the middle. So what lies partway between science and religion? My answer is reincarnation. (I am not saying this is the only choice, but I believe it to be a good choice. My experience in a few week period of my life, which I have mentioned elsewhere in this blog, led me to this belief. For me it was real, and therefore true, but I am not asking anyone else to believe me. I am only asking you, the reader, to hear what I am saying.) If there is a reason for life, not even a purpose, just a reason, then reincarnation makes a lot of sense. And it explains something I have never heard anyone else ask: Why are so many people so different from each other, while still maintaining  similarities in thought and disposition to many others, but never all others? But we are all macrophysically the same, are we not.

Reincarnation is a series of movements from knowing very little about life to knowing a lot about life. Each time a life becomes incarnate, it has the opportunity to regress, to stay virtually the same, or to progress. We cannot generally tell by looking at a living being if any of these three conditions is present in an individual–we have no idea what they may have been like before. Yet certain people we feel are older than others, having more wisdom than others, or more life experience. Why is that? And though I do not see this next feeling as often as I see the older being feeling, some people seem to be extraodinarily young. They are excited at anything new they see; they tend to believe anything absolutely anyone tells them. Even as adults they are very much like babies. Trusting, undiscerning, easily hurt, but quickly recovering. Young beings. Very young beings. Inbetween the young and the old seeming people, no matter their physical age, are the greatest numbers of people, people who act like many others, think like many others, and believe like many others. These would be those beings who have lived many lives, but have not yet determined if their lives have value. This is arguably similar to each individual as a whole–growing from a baby through teenagehood to adulthood towards seniority. And though these similarities exist, still there are so many different kinds of people who face life in so many different ways that others can see their individual characteristics. Let us call that our personalities.

Even those who believe in reincarnation differ greatly,  Some look at it through religious eyes, while others through other kinds of eyes. I myself see it through experiential eyes–there are those that fight who they are, while others accept who they are. Literally, there are millions or billions of people alive at any time who are similar yet different, while others are just different. Everything seems to depend on experience, but still different people react differently to different situations, and different stimuli.

I am not saying this is evidence of reincarnation, but it could be….

So why don’t we remember past lives, or past learnings? Well, some of us think we do, but so few find it easy to believe, especially here in the west, that the majority reject it out of hand.  In the east, where reincarnation is taught at a mother’s breast, the concept is much more acceptable. But no matter, there is still very little of what the scientific or religious communities would take as evidence, or beliefs, that reincarnation is a hard sell. Many want to believe it, for it takes the onus off living a saintly life this incarnation, but not so many actually do. Like heaven, it is a nice concept, not a sure thing.

So why can’t we remember? Can you imagine how complicated life would be if we could remember everything from past lives? Life would be unliveable. But, in my opinion, that is why we do not remember. Everything is built into us, all we have to do is need it, and it is there, already inside us.

This attempt at writing about reincarnation is woefully inadequate. I do not feel good about even publishing it. But I look at it as a start. Having got something down on paper is better than never having anything on paper. From here readers can ask questions, make comments, ridicule me if they like. But it is a start for communication. I hope you can appreciate my dilemma…

Advertisements

Author: rawgod

Still a Hippie, and proud of it. Have my BSW, now retired. Would have preferred to be a Dr. of Philosophy, but the university I went to wouldn't let me study my own philosophy. Your gain, their loss. I live on the edge of society with my partner, five cats, a broodmare, and a three year-old filly who might make her racing debut this coming summer or fall. Remember the name, Tricksy T Clanton.

56 thoughts on “Reincarnation Revisited”

  1. If reincarnation represents the need to believe that death isn’t the end of life, it strikes me as a (substitute?) religion in its own right, albeit not a ‘formal’ or organized one with a founder and/or leader(s). As such, I personally can’t regard it as anything more than interesting speculation…..which I have nothing against, but find less than compelling.

    Liked by 1 person

    1. Thanks for your take. I knew I didn’t write a good post, but I certainly did not intend for reincarnation to be a belief that death isn’t the end of life, but a possibility that life as we know it is much more then many people imagine it to be.
      Certainly it has the potential to become just another religion, except it already is a huge part of Buddhism, Hinduism, and Jainism, to mention the big three Eastern religions which teach reincarnation, all three of which predate Christianity and Islam. And I can barely speak to two of those, and certainly not any lesser Eastern religions.
      Meanwhile, I do not believe in any kind of theism, no gods or other superbeings walk the universal pathways between the stars and universes for me. But I do believe in life, and I don’t see life as something that can end.

      Like

  2. Many scientific folk are leaning toward a barely physical existence. Atoms are 99.999% empty space. You my friend, are 99.999% empty space. What we consider the empty parts is where life resides. It is full of energy filled with electrons, gluons, and quarks that make up its mass by being everywhere at once. When you die, that energy does not die, and the basic elements that make you are still “living“ atoms with electrons and energy. The seed of consciousness is in the energy, IMO, for now, maybe. Haha. Great post! Wonderful thoughts. I actually have a post on panpsychism on my editing board. Maybe Thursday I’ll be ready.

    Liked by 1 person

    1. This post was obviously an attempt at answering some of the questions you asked over a week or so ago. I wish I could have done a better job, but I could not stay focused, I found too many tangents to follow. But I tried. But I tried…
      I’ll be looking forward to your Thursday post. I certainly agree with parts of the material you showed me. I don’t like the label, but that’s a personal thing, and immaterial for all intents and purposes. Oh, considering the spaces in atoms and such, everything is immaterial, and I actually like it that way.

      Liked by 1 person

      1. I was challenged a bit by John 2 weeks ago to explore panpsychism and what I did was read the definition and put my mind to work with the universe. This morning I woke up and a picture came into focus. Writing what your brain is comprehending is difficult, especially in 500 words. Really, like you said it a great discussion point and maybe some ideas will get some traction. It was a Bible verse that cued me in on this. What “if” you read genesis as a science book and not a religious book? It may be closer to the truth than you think, based on one highly debated little word. I’m pretty sure I have the concept right. Closing the loop is the challenge.

        Like

  3. A bold attempt at tackling what can be for many a vexing concept when they try to understand it. Well you already know that reincarnation is a fact for me so no problem there. I would like to expound on your thought that we can’t remember because it would be too confusing. That doesn’t add up at all. Would be be confused if we could remember everything we were taught in school from grade one; if we could remember every event in our lives; how every personal relationship felt? We would be greatly expanded in awareness and in our need to become compassionate, empathetic beings. No, the reason we cannot remember simply has to do with programming. Most people hate to read that; there’s an inner squirming when confronted with the fact that they could indeed be controlled and there is little they can do about it. So enter denial. The Earthian pseudo-human creature is equipped with a (invisible!) implant called a soul. It doesn’t own this implant, nor is it, as claimed, the essence of the creature but it is carried as a mental slave collar. You (generic here) are not meant to remember because when you do you can no longer be lied to, conned, exploited, oppressed through fear- based chimeric beliefs and systems. Knowing means seeing through the wizard’s veil. This soul implant is what prevents an individual from ever achieving self-empowerment and full self-mastery; from engaging life definitely, with purpose. People with no purpose exist, going through the motions of life, with or without divinities. People with purpose live and they know they are living. Edgar Cayce (the Sleeping Prophet) could be a good example of how a truly freed mind operates.

    Like

    1. Alas, S’T, this is where we part ways. Although another reason for not remembering is possibly the pain of birth, which I have heard presented in many ways, it is for me about equal to the idea of a programmed soul. I will not argue this point with you, as I know where your belief comes from, and I know where my belief comes from. We take different paths that end up on a very similar ground, but those paths do not always mesh. This is one of those points.
      Ending up in the same place is more important than how we get there, I think.

      Like

      1. Fair enough rawgod, although I do not understand what you mean by ‘ending up in the same place’… To me, the cosmos is an infinite playground and if certain people “end up in the same place” well, that basically proves my point: programming, or call it brainwashing, persuasive advertising, faith, I don’t care. What brings people together in a certain place, say a ball game? Programming. What sends them all to fight some war? Programming. What stirs factions into genocidal madness? Programming. What makes them repeat their inhumane horrors endlessly? Programming. The evidence of programmed performance among Earthians is so blatant the only way to avoid it is by plunging totally into denial and that is also the result of programming. A long time ago I asked, ‘how is this possible? How is this programming done over such an enormous amount of time and over the entire Homo Sapiens species? I got my answer, it made perfect sense when checked against historical evidence, and I went from there. Some day, friend, everybody will know about this soul implant thing. Unfortunately it will be too late to save ‘your’ species. Yes, I mean that, yours, not mine. Sorry. Enjoy your choices while I live mine, rawgod.

        Like

        1. Ah, S’T, you miss my point totally. But we’ve been here before too, discussing the word “progress,” for example. Ending up in the same place is not a geographical statement, but a philosophical one. Our understanding of the cosmos is very similar, and though I cannot state that similarity properly at this moment because of memory issues, I know we basically understand things quite alike. You come “to this place” through your Teachers, while I come to it through pure thought. We use a completely different vocabulary, based on how we learned, or in my case, taught myself. That colours how we communicate. But in the end, as we have often discovered, we mean the same things.
          Or, in colloquial language, “we end up in the same place.” That was my bad, because I forgot you read words literally. I’m sorry too.

          Like

    2. You Stated — “No, the reason we cannot remember simply has to do with programming. ”

      My Response — If we are not the person we were 20 years ago (younger self) then reincarnation has no need for retaining memories.

      So if reincarnation were to happen it most likely would not incorporate past memories simply because they would not have any value to immediate awareness and mental growth.

      This is to say that if the first you became enlightened through life experiences then the second you would most likely do the same (no need for past memories).

      Like

      1. To answer in my own way, memories are not one of the things that move along from incarnation to incarnation except by accident. Or by strength of memory.
        Sha’Tara might say it differently, I won’t try to speak for her. In my experience it is not the memory that is important, it is only the learning.

        Liked by 1 person

  4. Interesting topic..
    My take….I like to use analogies. ..

    I think of the whole shebang as a soup, say. It’s full of all kinds of quarks, quantum fields, energy forces, time dimensions and probably many other “things” we know nothing about. This soup is permanent and has always been…a concept we are not equipped to grasp.

    Every now and then “real” matter will form maybe for a few seconds or maybe for zillions of years and wallah…a universe or many. And then life…you and me…

    But we die, as all things of matter do, and yes our energy or what ever goes back into the soup. And remember, atoms actually do decay in time, but fields and energy of some types, perhaps not.

    But bottom line, for my thoughts, Is that then you and I no longer exist. “We” are gone for all time never to return as any “alive” life in any form anywhere. A cold hard truth to me, but nonetheless…

    So while some field or quantum property may continue, that we affected in some way, it is not us.

    So the hope for reincarnation, even in a non religious form, is only a hope…a scientist’s hope for more, when he knows it’s not possible.

    Yes we may be part of this soup always in an unbelievably minuscule way, but for all practical purposes, we are gone.

    Don’t mean to be a bummer, RG, but it’s just the way I see things. And it’s not to take away from the truly beautiful idea of say a green burial, where we go back to nature and some cells can literally be found in trees or flowers and eventually birds of butterflies etc. That is a lovely idea to me…..but it still won’t be us.

    Liked by 1 person

    1. Acthually, Mary, you are seeing things quite similarly to how I see things. Life is a conglomeration of things, and individual consciousnesses do not survive per se. I didn’t really have the desire to go into my brand of reincarnation, as I have it from my LSD experiences 50 years ago this year, I was trying to stick to a sort of general understanding. Soup is where life started on Earth, what they call a primal soup, and a sort of soup is where the living spirit within us, the one which animates us, goes after our bodies die. Life itself never dies, it does not need atoms or quarks to exist. It is far beyond our science to understand.
      Thank you very much for your comment. It allowed me to say a few more particular statements, things I had tried to avoid. Another reason why I feel I did such a poor job of explaining.

      Like

      1. Speaking g of LSD…there is a body of though to give people who are dying a dose of LSD. A low dose, but enough to give them the thing you talk about…a feeling of connection to the universe and perhaps this life force quality, so they die in peaceful thoughts instead of fear. I think it’s a great idea. Should be part of hospice…, but it’ll ever happen in this country…too hung up on religious righteousness.

        Like

        1. It’s something I have thought of for myself, but finally decided against. I used LSD often before I hit on the path beyond reality. Yes, it did make me feel a connection to the universe, which I loved, but it was a good 8 hour experience, with the possibility of a bad trip never far away. I have heard there are ways to stop a trip midjourney nowadays, but I cannot imagine it. Getting to where I finally got was a process, and it involved more than one trip where I sat for three or four hours wishing for the trip to stop. I learned a lot about the power of the mind those days. Not everyone survived them, I lost a few friends to acid. (Not dead, but gone, a very sad thing to have to experience. One was a great musician, who never played again.)
          I guess it doesn’t matter if you are on your deathbed, but I would not wish a bad trip even on Donald J. Trump. But then, he doesn’t have a mind to lose, does he?

          Liked by 1 person

            1. I can see where this could be useful, but I’m not convinced, based on my own experience with the drug in my teens. Of course, there are many things that have changed, and the drug itself will be a lot more pure. Having medical personnel around also might make a difference.
              Meanwhile, I don’t know if this is related, but I do not fear death. To me there are two possibilities. Death will be final, and I will never know life stopped. Or death is only a change of consciousness, and at last I will discover if what I experienced was real or not. Either way, death is nothing to be scared of. Dying might be, if it is a long process, but the distance between life and death is but an angstrom wide, less than the blink of an eye. We are always but a bee’s wing-flap away from death, that much LSD did teach me. I don’t know how many people think of life that way, but it is why I say we need to acknowledge life. Life is the motivating force of the cosmos, whatever you think the cosmos to be. It is not a god, or a devil. It asks nothing of us but to live, and if possible, enjoy our lives. Religion tells us to suffer, the biggest piece of bullshit I have ever heard.
              Oops, I just lied. Life does have an inherent request for us, to respect life, and do nothing to harm living beings that are not-us. While this is impossible, since life lives on life, still we do not have to harm others wantonly. Many aboriginal people know this, they apologize to their food for having to eat it. Religious people used to know this, giving thanks for the food they were given. But that was in a time when we were involved in hunting and gathering. Now food is hunted and gathered in stores, far away from the killing of animals and plants. There is no connection for us anymore, not like there used to be. We forget lives were taken so that we could live. How can we thank our food for giving their lives for us?
              Suddenly I find I have mounted my soapbox, for which I apologize, Mary. I’ll shut up now…

              Liked by 1 person

              1. So when you write (this version) — Or death is only a change of consciousness, and at last I will discover if what I experienced was real or not., are you saying you believe you will “know” yourself in this new consciousness? That you will remember this life’s experiences? Or is it simply a “new” consciousness? If the latter, it would seem you would not remember your LSD experience so essentially, it would be all new and starting over.

                Maybe I’m getting too deep … but the subject is already pretty abstruse. 😉

                Like

                1. Hi, Nan. You aren’t getting too abtruse, but both your guesses are partially wrong based on my LSD experiences. (Please accept that what I am going to describe is nothing like the reality I saw during my trips, because I don’t have the words. I will do my best to give you an idea, but it will be an illusion, or a mirage.Just something to give you a sense of what I was dealing with.)
                  My living consciousness “travelled” from my body to the multi-consciousness pool, if I may call it that for a moment. This is on a different level of existence, but it was “me” who arrived there. Immediately what I still thought of as my feet started sinking into the pool of consciousness that was waiting there. Basically my “body” was being absorbed into the pool.of consciousness soup that was everywhere. When I decided I wanted to return to our reality here on Earth, that part of me already absorbed kind of flew out of the soup, losing parts of myself but also bringing some of the soup with it. I then travelled back to my body. I was still mostly me, but more than me in ways it took decades to decipher and accept. Anyways, it was me who made the trip, but if I had been completely absorbed into the soup what was me would have mostly disappeared and become a new being, a being that was changing with every new spirit that was also absorbed into the soup. And all the incoming memories would have disappeared when the next being was about to be born. What would have remained were the intangibles, like feelings and wisdom and life learning. What would have been factual stuff like names, school learning, and physical experiences would all be gone. Egos would have died. Brain stuff would have died. Only mind stuff would have remained.
                  The upshot is that I went through a process like death, but while I was still alive. I call it a Near Death Experience, but the NDE people laughed at me. They called it a drug-induced hallucination, when I tried to talk to them about it. LSD may have opened my mind, but what I experienced was not a hallucination. It was beyond my ability to imagine. And I am not the only one who had an experience very similar to this one, though we are few and far between.

                  Liked by 1 person

                  1. And …… O. K.! 🙂

                    Obviously, since the experience was yours and yours alone, it tends to leave the “rest of us” on the edges of understanding. Having said that, your description did (at least somewhat) make sense in that I could “visualize” what YOU “experienced.”

                    It still leaves some questions unanswered, but that’s OK. The topic is pretty esoteric anyway. In any case, thanks for your description … it does help. Somewhat. 😉

                    Like

                    1. I wish I could do more, and I would love to hear your questions. Please don’t hold yourself back. Sometimes I am too close to something, despite being 50 years removed from it. Questions can provide a new perspective, or a new way to consider something I have wrestled with over time. This is the topic that is most dear to me in my life. It has haunted me since 1969, but it has informed me just as long. Anything that helps to obtain greater understanding is very much appreciated.
                      Maybe I went quietly insane (I’m sure I did for some while at least), and have never recovered, but I love myself for being who I have become, and I don’t think anyone can ask much more of that in their lives. Not to say I am perfect, I’m not, and my physical health leaves a lot to be desired, but mentally I am better now than when I was born, and I certainly hope reincarnation is real, because I would like to have the opportunity to go on learning like this. Life is incredible for me. I don’t want it to stop, though I am perfectly ready if it does.

                      Liked by 1 person

                2. Oh, possibly I misunderstood one of your questions, although I may have inadvertently answered it anyway. If, when I do die in this incarnation, my experiences were real, no, the next reincarnated being will not have the memories, but it will have the innate learning that took place during this present lifetime. From what I have deciphered from my experiences, we do not stay as we are, but our learning is forever, if we choose to accesss it.?

                  Like

                  1. The questions that remain are pretty much unanswerable — mainly because none of can know whether there is an actual “afterlife” (in whatever form). Essentially, it’s just something we’ll have to experience (or not) when the time comes.

                    Having said that, I think your outlook on death is great! If what you believe comes to pass, all the better. If it doesn’t, well, you’ll never know. Right?

                    IMO, the primary thing any of us should focus on is THIS life. Make it the best we can. Enjoy all that it has to offer. To suffer through its tribulations in hopes of “something better” is a real waste of the time we have. As I’ve expressed several times … Carpe Diem! There may not be another one.

                    Liked by 1 person

                    1. My take is slightly different, but not that dissimilar:
                      Be the best living being I can be, in hope that life will not end. If life ends, who cares! If it doesn’t, I’m ready…
                      Enjoy life, definitely, as long as I don’t hurt other living beings to enjoy myself.
                      Obey myself, no one else.
                      Respect all living beings, I might get respect back. If I don’t, that is up to others, not me.
                      I can only do unto others that which I am willing to allow others to do unto me.
                      Don’t panic. Or get angry. Crazy shit happens when I do either.
                      The above are only guidelines. There may be times and specific situations that call for other tactics. Be prepared to implement them.

                      Liked by 1 person

                    2. Ah, Nan, I keep coming back to your comment, wondering how I can improve my response. When you say in hopes of “something better,” maybe this is where I should aim an arrow. Reincarnation is not about making one life progressively better than the last. (The christian heaven or the muslim paradise are shoot-offs of this idea.) When reincarnation brings one’s spirit back to the physical realm (not a good description, but one more easily understood when using English), there is no promise of a better life, just another chance to learn something new about life.
                      The new circumstances will provide a new opportunity. Better or worse? Who is to say, unless you actually can remember something from a previous incarnation. Most people won’t.

                      Like

                    3. … wondering how I can improve my response

                      rawgod, the only one that’s concerned about your response is you. I really don’t spend much time thinking about what happens “after.” As I’ve indicated, we’ll either experience something after death … or we won’t. Simple as that. I tend to lean towards the latter but that’s just me. One thing is for certain, until someone comes back to “share,” it’s all speculation anyway.

                      Like

                    4. Yes, it is more for me than you, but I would like to learn how to say it best for posterity’s sake. My blog is a record of my thoughts for after I die. I would like it to be more definitive. I make it sound like I am talking to you, but you represent others to me. Would they ask similar questions? Probably. So I try to get it right…

                      Like

  5. Do you ever wonder, if man was constantly being reincarnated to learn and grow, why there appears to be no progress or very little? And of late, things seem to be going backwards.

    If we survive climate change, trump and the republicans, unbounded greed and the lust for war…the next step will be some association and commingling with artificial intelligence. The learning will occur from computerization and not reincarnation… I know I’m a real reductionist…just me..

    Liked by 1 person

    1. As I said to rawgod at the outset of this discussion on reincarnation, the never listened to argument as to why nothing changes here is called PROGRAMMING. I have explained how that programming is achieved but that too is a taboo approach, so no-go. Therefore Earthians will continue to spin their silly wheels in their Matrix muck and look to answers everywhere and anywhere except where may be found. That too, is very much a result of the programming. Who wants to believe that they carry a controlling implant by which they are mentally and emotionally pushed to believe a certain way, to ignore the obvious, to insist on repeating destructive patterns that have no hope of ever producing those hoped-for results? It’s so much easier to simply continue believing in what the programming declares to be ‘the right way’ and when that doesn’t pan out, to blame someone else, or something else for not believing correctly… according to the programming, of course. It will be that way until this civilization collapses from its own corruption based on ignorance…

      Like

    2. I don’t see us surviving climate change, at least not in numbers large enough to recover anytime soon. And I would like to think if anyone survives, they will give a long hard look at what went on. You are a reductionist, I am a dreamer…
      Reincarnation gives people the opportunity to live and grow, but it cannot force anyone to take those opportunities. Still, looking at the world through a spiritual change lens, there are a lot more caring, aware people in the world today than there were 500 years ago. And it is people like us who are scaring the hell out of people who don’t want change. You could say we are the vanguard of world peace, but our numbers are still too small to count. We arep in a very vulnerable position, and conservative leaders are hoping to stop the trend. They cannot do so without committing worldwide suicide, but they cannot believe that is even possible.
      So, until I die and don’t wake up, I expect to be reincarnated, here or elsewhere. It really is the most logical stand to take compared to either science or religion. If there is another possibility, I have yet to think of it.

      Like

    3. You Stated — “Do you ever wonder, if man was constantly being reincarnated to learn and grow, why there appears to be no progress or very little?”

      My Response — It seems to me that when it comes to reincarnation major assumptions are allowed that fit a positive framework.

      What if reincarnation is a prison system, where the inmates are forced to keep reliving life knowing they could die one day while the rest of the universe enjoys immortality?

      What if reincarnation is a scientific mistake caused by some accident in our far future and upon each reiteration, we become more unstable?

      What if reincarnation is controlled by the rich to keep a workforce in place to serve them?

      Like

        1. If I may give my answer here, Nan, reincarnation is real. How Lander will answer that, or how anyone will answer that, is up to them. But from the viewpoint of my life and my experience, nothing else makes sense. For me!
          But I do not see reincarnation as Buddha did, I am not hoping to find nirvana. Nirvana would be as boring as heaven/hell or parasdise…
          There is always something new to learn, even if we have to create it for ourselves.

          Like

          1. I didn’t ask for “validity” or “perspective.” I asked if these scenarios indicated reincarnation was real. The answer would, of course, be your opinion and I would accept it as such.

            Like

            1. It’s not real within our current understanding since it doesn’t provide any solid proof that can be reproduced.

              The door is still open to the possibility of it being real because we are lacking answers to the strange phenomenon of past memory recall in young children.

              Unanswered questions keep the door open but lack of evidence prevents it from making the grade.

              Liked by 1 person

          1. Sorry … waaaay too much “data” for me. Not that you haven’t provided an interesting perspective (from the little I read), but I have an aversion to reading posts that take me more than a couple of minutes. Nine times out of ten, the writer is simply reinforcing his/her viewpoint via various sources which, if listed, could be researched by readers who find the topic interesting.

            Are you an academic by any chance? Your “About Us” page essentially tells me nothing.

            Like

      1. To begin, I don’t see reincarnation to be even a framework, because that infers design, and I do not believe in design–I believe in chaos of a sort, especially in the beginning if there was one.
        But given a “framework” for the sake of discussion, it is only in the macro that I see it as a positive thing, because experiencing physical life over and over would hopefully lead to a positive result. As I said, reincarnation can lead to regression, inertia, or progression in the micro–each incarnation stands on its own merits.
        All these negative possibilities you mention are possible. Anything is possible! But in my opinion they are very improbable. All of tjem would require design, and as I said, I do not believe in design. If any of them is real, there is no use in having life in the first place. Real progress would be impossible. I feel that progress is doable, from my own experience. I am not the living being I was a number of lives ago. In fact, I am not even the living being I was born as this lifetime. I have changed greatly, but for me there has to be a backstory. The “I” I am did not just happen, it is the result of long struggle. Millions of earth-years of struggle.

        Liked by 1 person

        1. Interesting perspective: From a chaos position reincarnation would be even more likely given that it halts order and progression.

          You spend a lifetime “changing greatly” only to be memory wiped, and thrown into a strangers home, where you are forced to start over with no idea where you are or how you got there (chaos)

          Just a thought

          Like

          1. There may be a memory wipe of sorts involved, certainly there is a memory block on things dangerous to a brand new mind, but the spirit is not washed of everything it has learned in previous incarnations, it has an actual bearing on the underlying personality as the mind grows capable of handling it. This does not mean the mind will remember anything at all, but it is there to access should the new being ever decide to do it, or possibly as I did, stumble upon it. Mostly it is behind the scenes as a causality, a subconscious memory or feeling that affects certain aspects of the new incarnation. This is part of the chaos! If the mind is hijacked early on, or brainwashed by something like a religion or cult or even just a forceful educator of some kind, anything is possible, including regression.
            I, the spiritual me, do not expect to lose the changes I have made in this lifetime. I don’t expect to remember much about my physical or mental life, but my spiritual changes will travel to the next incarnation wherever or whenever that might be. Left to my own devices, as I more or less was this incarnation, I expect to have a more spiritual base next life. How that will eventuate I do not know, there are a lot of chaotic factors still to be dealt with, but that is for next life. For now I just try to understand as best I can where I am right now. IMO, the more i solidify my position while I am here, the easier it will be when my spirit returns to physical reality again.

            Like

  6. You Stated — “So if we know death, we must also know life. What do you think?”

    My Response — I don’t think we understand or know either. I also don’t think we need to this early on in our progression. Mankind is too young to be burdened with having to know life and death. We should focus on something much more tangible like “Love”. We can experience it in real-time.

    Just a thought

    Like

  7. In my philosophy, Lander, there are no shoulds, no oughts, no musts. What we do is what we do, regardless of what others think we should or ought to do. Anything can happen, and we can interpret it, or not, in any way we like.
    You interpret “Love” as tangible, but is it really? One can feel it, possibly even experience it, but does this mean we know it? You have already admitted you don’t know life, yet isn’t love as unknowable as life. We feel and experience life too, the similarities between life and love are incredible, but there is one difference. One can experience life without love, but one cannot experience love without life. Life is a priori to love. You must be alive to know love.
    But do we even know what love is? Is love lust? It certainly appears to be when we are teenagers, whether we admit it or not. In my mind when we meet someone and instantly feel a great desire to be closer to that person, what we are feeling is lust. But we are told lust is not a good thing, that love “must” come before lust, so we believe ourselves to be falling in love. We cannot say, “Oh, baby, I lust for you!” when that is exsctly what we are feeling in most cases. We are discovering physical attraction, the need or desire to be together, but we don’t yet have any idea what “real love” is!
    So do we need to know what real love is before we can feel what we accept as “real love”? No we don’t. But it would help, wouldn’t it! Likewise, knowing what life and death are would help us understand what we are doing with our lives, but it does not stop us from living, or dying. This is true whether reincarnation is real or not. But starting from scratch every time makes understanding life, and love, nigh on impossible. Understanding experience comes with repetition. Reincarnation is the doorway to understanding.
    In my opinion.

    Like

    1. You Stated — “Reincarnation is the doorway to understanding.”

      My Response — A library is a better doorway.

      You Stated — “You interpret “Love” as tangible, but is it really? One can feel it, possibly even experience it, but does this mean we know it? ”

      My Response — Good things don’t need to be understood. The first person to have ever gotten an orgasm was full of confusion but very happy. I love cheesecake but I don’t really know anything about it. My brain isn’t really touching or tasting it (just receiving an electrical signal)

      Love is as real as anything else, just an electrical signal interpreted to the brain. So, love is real and tangible and does not require understanding. Lust, on the other hand, is just for immature minds who lack imagination and focus, a fail-safe to keep the species going.

      Like

      1. I’ll just say if humans did not want to understand, there would be no science. If humans did not want to speculate, there would be no religion.
        The first person to ever have an orgasm was acting according to nature, and instinct. There was no confusion, there were only pheromones he had no idea even existed. I see it in young kittens all the time. A female goes into heat, and a male kitten as young as two months will want to mount her. He cannot get her pregnant, I don’t think, not at that age, but he is determined to try. It takes a human male years to get to that point, but no one has to tell him what to do. He might have trouble getting it right the first time, but he knows where to centre his attention. So does the girl. But none of this speaks to love on either side of the equation. It speaks only to instinct.
        Romantic love is only known because we are told about it, and expect to feel it. Other kinds of love are different, but I won’t go into them here.

        Like

  8. I truly need to read this a few times.
    I will pop in the cliche “it resonates” but even cliches can be true.
    When I started researching the “characteristics” of those who “were reincarnated” I was not as surprised as I imagined myself to be when I identified with so many of the items that the writers of various articles mentioned.
    I won’t go into detail because I do believe this will still be a personal issue for each person to a large degree.
    Even debating it doesn’t really concern me anymore.
    With each year I care less about “convincing” anyone about anything.
    I do like the concept that life transcends our Earthly perception of what life constitutes.
    For me life has to be more than a period of time within which cell division, conversion of food into energy etc etc transpired.
    So many things we do is geared towards a perpetuation of life…. “Leaving a legacy for future generations.”
    Perhaps the very act of “leaving a legacy” is a collective consciousness that prompts us to start noticing we “were” here before, and we will be coming around again.
    Death is not the end.

    Like

    1. One hopes not, but don’t get sidetracked into going to an eternal heaven or hell. Once there, you are stuck!
      Meanwhile, I shall be waiting for further comments and observations…

      Liked by 1 person

      1. The funny thing is, even from a Biblical perspective “eternal damnation” doesn’t make sense… “Heaven” does make sense on a mechanistic level at times… If that ties in with reincarnation

        Like

Leave a Reply

Fill in your details below or click an icon to log in:

WordPress.com Logo

You are commenting using your WordPress.com account. Log Out /  Change )

Google photo

You are commenting using your Google account. Log Out /  Change )

Twitter picture

You are commenting using your Twitter account. Log Out /  Change )

Facebook photo

You are commenting using your Facebook account. Log Out /  Change )

Connecting to %s